What is a Hospitality Skills Passport?

30 years of festival chef, 10 years working as a lecturer, what used to be known as Westminster Kingsway College but is now called CCC Westminster and where I worked there as the manager of the Mayor's Hospitality Skills Academy since 2022.

There's a shortage of skills and a shortage of people.

Big time, big coming into big club, the skills gap there big time. So a second work based academy program. But however what it is, it's a universal entry standard called hospitality skills passport.70% is on the job, 20% is mentorship coaching, 10% is the education piece. Important part is that work experience part at the end of it with the employers and you know, nine times out of ten there's a job offer at the end.

Hello Vince, welcome to Talking Hospitality.

Thanks for having me. Pleasure to be here.

So Vince, who are you and what do you do?

Yeah, so my name is Vince Kelly.30 years of professional chef, 10 years working as a lecturer, what used to be known as Westminster Kingsway College, what is now called CCC Westminster and where I work there as the manager of the Mayor's hospitality skills Academy since 2022. But there's a lot more than that to me I guess.So I'm going to also I'm a proud guardian of grub food waste ambassador and I, I just really like to advocate for plan forward thinking when it comes to the curriculum because I personally find it and a lot of people do that, it's, it's quite me heavy and I think in the modern world we need to have a lot more thinking of our own plan forward. So yeah, some, one of the guys in work the other day called me a plant pusher. But yeah, that's my passion I'd say.

And that's, that's very interesting as well in itself. Now with hospitality, hospitality right now is an interesting space. I would say it's had its fair share of issues.

It's had a, had a tough time, hasn't it?

And it looks like it's going to continue to be for a while and one of the things that we, we're aware of is there's a shortage of skills and shortage of people, you know.

Big time, big coming into big time. A skills gap there. Big time. Yeah.

Now there's the skills gap from people coming in and also skills gap of people currently there and that, that is obviously an issue. I mean you know if you look from the top heavy point of view, where we've lost older people who decided not to come back into the industry.Who's going to teach the younger people? But then we've got a younger set of people that are about to come into industry.

Yeah.

That nobody's showing them how to do anything.

Yeah. And there's this perception, right? Yeah. There's like a perception of the industry that's totally wrong.And you know, I've, as I said, I've worked in it for a very long time and I also used to run my own places back in, when I was in Ireland as well.And you know, it's such a diverse, inclusive, accessible sector and I always think of it as like a community and even working in the space, me and you know each other and you just see the network is just amazing and it can open up so many different career paths and it's just so undervalued in some ways and that can be quite frustrating. Even as a, as an FE college, you know, even with referrals that are sent to us as well.It's this sort of perception that, oh, just go put them into hospitality. But that's not it.It's such a professional professional and I'm so glad we get those people because they just, they love it and they really engage with it then. And it's like they found their, they found their tribe if you look. And they come into hospitality too, which is fantastic.

I think that's, that's a really good point. Right. Because with hospitality there's a perception from people outside of it that's not that professional, but it's not professional.It's not one way you stay and yeah, when you've got people like you and me being in hospitality a long time. Right.

Yeah, I'm not that long speaking.

So I stopped counting at 20

It'S been 25 years. I was like "Let's keep it at 20"

20 plus.

20 plus. And I've got my going now because I'm still, I'm still reeling over the 25 plus.And yeah, and we know it's, it's a profession that takes you quite a long way. Opens the doors to a lot of people. Networking, I mean, you know, I'm working currently, five star luxury that is, you know, elite.

If I even take my own career journey. I mean, I started as a kitchen porter, left school early. You know, I Won't go through too many details. 14 years of age, working as a KP.Loved the kitchen, started working in the kitchen, worked at all sorts of levels of the industry submission place when I was younger and then opened some five star hotels and things along the way.But also just, you know, great, really gastro pubs, funky little, you know, cafes and stuff along the way and really interesting community all the way through all of that. But you know, and then I actually ended up running my own businesses and stuff as well, so. And then the diversified into Iridium.I worked for charity for a while as well, teaching kids from difficult social backgrounds and that kind of really got me into the lecturing side of it. And then, you know, I've had a really great career so far.Westminster, which has been going really well and even with that there's other things that come off the side of that and you get to know so many different people.I've got a community interest company called Culinary Medicine as well and there's so many different things that roads open up and avenues open up for you in the industry and there's so many different pathway so you can go down.You know, I taught in higher education at the college as well and you know, a lot of people go to product food, product development and tech food technologists, you know, some very high skills set there. So yeah, great transferable skills or what we like to call these days professional skills.But a lot of that going on and you know, so many people go to have touched the industry at some stage of their career, whether I was a part time job or going to university or whatnot. But what I want people to do is think about it as a career, you know, because it is a really great career, not just a part time job.So we're doing a lot of work on that at the moment.

Is because we other countries, like France, for example, hospitality is considered like a profession. You know, you go to school, you do it and it could be a career for life, you know.You know, in the UK it's not seen so much unless you're actually in hospitality.But also what I've noticed increasingly is when people are advertising for entry level jobs within hospitality, they're also then asking for some level of experience, which means they can't possibly be entry level. Now I believe that you're working on a solution to that actually, because, you know, where do people. How do I get that first job in hospitality?

Yeah.

And, but how do I Get the Skills to do it?

Such a, such a catch 22. Yeah, isn't it? As we spoke with, when we were bringing this together, we're, we're admitting that sometimes, you know, they look for about 12 months of back of house experience or six months from the house experience before they take someone on. And it was, we were arguing, well how can we get to that point? We've got to get to that point.So yeah, so a lot of work has gone on with UK hospitality and Springboard have been involved as well and a few other colleges around to UK and they did run a little pilot of this in Wales a couple of years ago and it's working directly with dwp. So your job centers and stuff. And so we've been trailblazing the swap element of that. So a sector work based academy program.Well, however what it is, it's a universal entry standard called Hospitality skills passport. So if we take things like construction had a CSCS license, security has a SIA license and they're good entry levels. Right.Because when you do a little short course, you're getting something for that and it's giving you, preparing you, getting you very work ready. And this is a thing with our industry, we don't have a universal standard.I mean most, you know, colleges and training places and different organizations are actually doing about 70% of this, maybe 80% of this. But it'd be great.We just want to get everyone doing it the same way because that's where you, that's the first steps in professionalizing anything really I think and as we all feel.So the idea was to build a hospitality skills passport that would work backwards from all those knowledge, skills and behaviors that are needed to do the apprenticeship and to do the level twos and do all of that. So working backwards and look for kind of any. Everything that kind of plays into all of that. So there's proper progression onto that.So the idea with this is to. So what we do at the college want to sector work based gallery program.So taking people directly from job centers and other referral partners and people can come in from anywhere, it's no problem. And even if you've worked the industry before, some people actually been out of it for a while find it very useful as well to reconnect.And we've got some great employers. It's very important. The employers have such a huge role in all of this and they're being really great the ones we're working with so far.And we're always looking for more.And the idea is that they really give the wraparound because, you know, even when it comes to skills, I think in the education process, 70% is on the job, 20% mentorship coaching, 10% is the education piece. So, you know, there's only so much that we can do.It's more getting them those professional skills across the line, getting to understand the, the basic skill needs at different level of each thing, front of house and back of house. So they just do like five weeks, three days a week, it's about, about 20 days in total or somewhere around that.But they, they engage with this short program.Most important part is that work experience part at the end of it with the employers and, and you know, nine times out of 10, there's a job offer at the end of that work experience for somebody as well. So, so it works really well. And it's. Don't want to say try before you buy, but it kind of works out like that.You know, you're able to have a look, proper look at somebody and they've done a little bit with us at Westminster and, and then they can head on and go straight into it confidently go in there, do their work experience and get, you know, hopefully get a job at the end of it or certainly get on my radar for something down within the next six months or thereabouts because, you know, we're not always hiring Arian and there's always, you know, little busier times that we're going into one now with the summer coming out. So, yeah, there's always, you know, it's great, they reconnect, they get to know them, they know who they are, they help them then and they can.They tap into that down the line.

So you talked about standards, like there isn't a universal standard for hospitality. What is it that this program is teaching the people coming in?

Yeah, so we do three kitchen skills, three bar and barista skills, customer service, we do three sessions on that as well. And then we do a lot around employability as well.Within all those sessions though, it's very role play, simple things like, you know, play carrying, put a bit of water on the plates, getting them not to spill the water and making it a bit of fun and that sort of thing. But.And also even with the kitchen skills, because you'll get people that just want to do the front of house element and want to work in the kitchen, but, you know, explain to them, you know, we're circular economy here and you got to make sure that you understand what happens in the back to understand the front and you know, helps them to understand the level 2 hygiene and all that side of it as well and the religion training and they understand all the barriers that when they do both.But we also just make them engage in cooking sessions something for themselves because you know, there's a lot to be said about self help in our industry.Fihan made the chefs I know to go to a tasty takeaway on the way home instead of making fleer make wishes their food all day and then get a quick fix on the way home. It'd be better to, for us to start thinking healthier in that way. Yeah.So just all of that and they really, really engage with all of that and it's likewise if they want to do back of house, they want to do front.Sorry if they want to work back a house in the kitchen and they're doing the front of house skills, you got to understand how the front of house operates for you to understand who you're cooking for and understand your customers and understand what fun to house is going through. A lot of the time is built by dealing with some of these customers and that's just, you know, they're so. It's great.The cross training element's really important I think. And also people that might think one way and then by the end of it they want to go the other, you know. Yeah.Front of house is a, a career path that we don't, don't push enough. Like you were saying, it's you know, big in France and Switzerland and Italy and Europe.It's very well, well, well respected and yet it just seems to be a part time job here in the UK and shifting is always the more glorified part. But you know, I think that's just celebrity chefs, is it? I think that's what that might be.It's just we, we do love a celebrity chef in the UK and our Bake off and everybody.

Yeah, that's true. Although our bar staff don't tend to do too badly because I think that's kind of like when you're younger it's kind of a cool job to have, isn't it?Yeah, you know, but yeah, so that's quite interesting. So it's basically, it's, it sounds like it's, it is like a pathway into an introduction of hospitality. That's what it sounds like to me.And then you've got like, we're going to give you some basics, deal some opportunities to learn and then the sort of the icing on the Cake of that is then you get an opportunity to work within an organization.

Yeah. Put it into practice experience and seeing that. So good. A good kind of overview of just a bit of everything.What, what is involved in all the different roles, how to practically do them roles. Definitely your statutory training part as well. Just so you understand, so you feel confident when you're going to do the work experience.What are all these different chopping boards for, what way should the plates be, what way should a cutlery be and stuff like that so you're not getting confused or anything because confidence, everything is about confidence. And I think with especially a lot of candidates come in from.For us we take in three groups of 1545 just happened in last week and I can, you know it's, it's really, really, really interesting to see the journey of them over that five weeks even though it's only five weeks but to see them come true and the way they are at the end of it, completely different people. So that's really, really positive.And then then a couple of years later you start seeing them coming back through doing the part time programs and stuff or meet them, you might meet them around London sometimes and they're telling you how they did and they're quite happy, you know, it's good.

Well that's actually the next question I was going to have. What after they've completed this, done the work experience, what's the next step or stages for them?

Yeah, so what we do then is we'll get feedback from them and feedback from the, from the employers and the employers are interested in anybody, they let us know and then we make the introduction and give them a bit of extra support there.We have like a drop in job club system so they can, they can come back, you can re engage with the job center, you can do the employability sessions on the next group and stuff. So we don't just say oh that's it, it's here now.It's very much how can we wrap around this and give you whatever shown, give them, signpost them into the next courses that will be available, what will be the new starts and try and get them, you know, to come to, to keep coming back until they get right up the ladder. Yeah.And then for the employers it's really, really a good system because they get to then pick off ones that they really did like and did engage with and we can put them in contact with them and then we just ask them to report back to us what was the outcome of those conversations and interviews and stuff. Yeah, so what is.

Because you're. I know you're a massive advocate of this. Like, we were at the Southwark Hospitality Skills Hub.

Yeah.

And you on the screen, I was talking about what we're trying to do, the hotel that I was working at the time, and you, you, you. You were like, hang on a minute, I want to talk to. I want to spread the word about this on the. On talking hospitality. And of course, now you are.

Yeah.

So what is, what is your, what's your passion behind this? What is your goal from rolling this out?

Yeah, I just. I want to. We want to, as part of Mares Hospitality Skills Academy and myself, we would like to have a. Like, sort of an umbrella system.So that's why I really latched on to this Skills Passport piece, because so many people are doing great work, but we're not all doing it in the same way. And I hate that working in Silo, you know, let's work in partnership and collaborate.I think that's a new way of saying, I'll scratch your back, you'll scratch mine.Well, anyway, partnerships and collaborations are fantastic and we've got to a really good stage now where we've got a lot of different college groups within something, which is like an employer board I have going, called the hesh, which is Hospitality employer, Skills Hub, and we bring in. Anyone can join that. So employers join that, other colleges join it.We have, like, Chamber of Commerce in there, we have the Greater London Authority, UK Hospitality and the Director of Worker Pensions.So everybody's speaking to each other finally, which is great to see, and everyone understands what's happening and people can see the barriers that we might have for funding and understand why we don't do certain things or do things certain ways.And that's been really, really beneficial for the employers and to understand how apprenticeships work and how all these things are changing and, you know, governments change, things are changed and we're able to kind of keep each other updated, really, and share best practice.And so the idea with this, with the Skills Passport piece is that if we could all be doing it in the same sort of way and then we could be tracking this data a little bit better and having it all fall under an umbrella at the Skills Academy and we'd be able to. To get that data together and understand, you know, the impact, the problems, the barriers and move this forward progressively.

Yeah. So it sounds like potentially this is like the beginning potentially of something.

Yeah.

Of the. Of standardization. And this is the first step, because now you're bringing People coming together.

Yeah.

Having a conversation because hospitality is. We've even had podcasts about it. Quite siloed. There's a lot of people saying, I'm going to make change over here, I'm make change over here.But I'm quite pulled together. So it sounds like we're finally getting something that is pulling.

This could be the. Like I always say, this is not me, this is not, oh, I don't want to be the lead. I don't mind helping being the lead, but I'm not their lead of this.Like let's say, yeah, work together and try and somebody else take the lead in like West London College for example, we're doing a next meeting there and we want the employers to actually do the meetings as well and have us in their places and be able to show us some things and talk about what they, what they would like to see more, what they want to be more involved in.But because there's so many great things going on and that's the thing, we're all very passionate people in those industry and again that community piece and I just feel that if we just start working together, imaginary things we could achieve.I think, you know, there's some serious to professional people I've met over the years and you know, I'd like to see them, you know, shine a bit better maybe if we all went together with things.

So I'm an employee and I'm like an employer. Listen to this. And I'm like, oh, this is something I really want to get my teeth into. I like the idea. Bit nervous about it, not quite sure.I mean what steps should they take to, to get involved?

Yeah, I mean the first steps, very easy, just have a, I do arrange little teams call and so I'll give it my email address and stuff and reach out. I'll do a teams call which you'll be able to show you have a quick slide. It won't be death by PowerPoint, don't worry. It'd be very quick and easy.

And I've had the, just so you know, I have had the PowerPoint and it's, it's not a death by PowerPoint, I assure you.

And then we just, you know, if you want, you can come in, we can show you around the place so you get a good, a good understanding of the quality, quality that was there and to, to reassure the employer because it's that six month, 12 month thing where they're saying, oh, we want to have 6 month experience front of house and back. So I kind of tried to take that away by saying, look at what we do here at the college. And we're there over 100 years, you know, found by Guy Savoys.These are Ritz and Oscof Gay. So it's got some rich history. CCC Westminster.And when you come there you'll, you'll be convinced for sure that we, we do have the skills, the equipment and the people to turn these turn to help get people to a certain level when they come to do their work experience and that you'd be quite pleased then to take them on from there. So if you come and talk to us, we show you around, we can do that bit as well.And then you just basically fill in a form to register yourself for doing the work experience pieces. And that's usually where we try to make us a starting point. And then we also. You're at it.Then you come to the hospitality employer skills hubs and obviously might be people may be small to medium enterprises here, there might be bigger employers and if they're groups and things, they always have different places and different regions of London. And I'm, we are pan London.So you know, when you come to the hospital skills hub meetings every quarter, you get to meet all the other colleges, all the other departments of worker pensions and whatnot. So you can kind of have outreach in other areas. You don't have to put them off. We can only do 45 people a month, so there's lots of other engagement.They'll all do the same.The idea is they run the same system them so you can feel assured that it's all the way you way the way to the level that we all want it to be to get them ready, work ready.

Amazing. So we're going to have obviously links. If you go into the description of the podcast, we'll have links there.But also if you go to talkinghospitality.com if you go to Vince's Vince Kelly on the guest profile, we have contact details there if you want to reach out to him directly.

Yeah.

Vince, thank you so much for coming today. It's been a pleasure.

Great, thanks for having me.

I'm looking forward to working with you on the project and if anyone's listening that wants to join, looking forward to working with you as well. Yeah, let's be the start of something great.

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